Marvin Shilmer

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Posts by Marvin Shilmer

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  274

  Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

  by Simon in

  1. social
  2. current

  sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

  "oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

  you're fired!"..

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  Marvin Shilmer

  I don't see this as a civil rights issue, more like a moral wrong issue.

  The thing that makes this a civil rights issue is the business license under which the concern operates. This is part of the public infrastructure.
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  77

  Blood Transfusion: Letter of Understanding

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://ajwrb.org/science/blood-transfusion-letter-of-understanding.

  "every parent among jehovahs witnesses worried about how local watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this letter of understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them.

  then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the childs best interests.".

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  Marvin Shilmer

  I read your blog before, nothing remarkable, only commentary.

  The "commentary" is to publicize that Watchtower advertises one policy (i.e., its 1992 policy) yet has so far not advertised its complicity with the letter of understanding document that is less stringent.

  Using the term agreement referring to the document on this thread led me to believe that you were referring to the document as an agreement. Since you did not clarify what you meant but made remarks about the WT not advertizing it, It seemed to me that you meant that it was a secret agreement. Your remarks on this thread about the document also led me to believe that it was a covert document, secretly allowing blood transfusions. I wonder how many people believed that too until I showed that it was not. I see that now that you deny asserting it.

  The document in question (i.e., letter of understanding) is an agreement. Watchtower is okay with it. It represents a change from its 1992 position. Watchtower has yet to publicize this less stringent position to rank and file membership. All this has been spelled out. Try reading what I've actually said rather than reading your conclusions into what I've said.

  explain

  "It is estimated that approximately 1000 Jehovah’s Witnesses die annually worldwide and as many as 100,000 may have died by abstaining from blood transfusions since the blood ban was introduced in 1945."--The Management of Adult Jehovah’s Witnesses in Anaesthesia and Critical Care, by AM Welsh in Australasian Anaesthesia, 2011, pp. 125-132

  
  Watchtower's position on blood transfusion has led to tens of thousands of premature deaths.
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  77

  Blood Transfusion: Letter of Understanding

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://ajwrb.org/science/blood-transfusion-letter-of-understanding.

  "every parent among jehovahs witnesses worried about how local watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this letter of understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them.

  then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the childs best interests.".

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  Marvin Shilmer

  1)You talk a lot. I am not persuaded.

  I have more to say in response to that, too.

  1. I don't care if you are persuaded, or not.

  Questions?
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  77

  Blood Transfusion: Letter of Understanding

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://ajwrb.org/science/blood-transfusion-letter-of-understanding.

  "every parent among jehovahs witnesses worried about how local watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this letter of understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them.

  then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the childs best interests.".

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  Marvin Shilmer

  2) What is your specific point(s) about WT and their position on BT

  I do have more to say in response to that very broad question.

  1. Watchtower's position on blood transfusion is irrational.

  2. Watchtower's position on blood transfusion is dishonest.

  3. Watchtower's position on blood transfusion has led to tens of thousands of premature deaths.

  Questions?
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  77

  Blood Transfusion: Letter of Understanding

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://ajwrb.org/science/blood-transfusion-letter-of-understanding.

  "every parent among jehovahs witnesses worried about how local watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this letter of understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them.

  then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the childs best interests.".

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  Marvin Shilmer

  1)You talk a lot. I am not persuaded. What is your specific point about this document.
  2) What is your specific point(s) about WT and their position on BT

  My specific point is as my blog article states:

  "Completing this document requires no knowledge that 1) a treating physician has record of good cooperation with Jehovah’s Witness patients, 2) a past record of performing a particular “bloodless” procedure along with 3) sentiment that the same procedure will be “no problem” this time. This is a change from Watchtower's published policy dating to 1992.[2]

  "The Letter of Understanding document is a written and signed record that parents of a Witness child have been informed their child will be given the best medical treatment available, including transfusion of blood products forbidden under Watchtower doctrine if treating physicians deem it necessary."

  Is there something about that you don't understand?

  Fact: The posted "Letter of Understanding" is not a WT agreement consenting BT. I have shown that.

  I've not asserted that. So what is your point saying this to me?
  
  

  Fact: As it is written, the LOU when executed by JW is not an authorization for hospital to administer BT. I have shown that.

  I've not asserted that. So what is your point saying this to me?

  A further point of my blog article addressing the letter of understanding is this:

  "Every parent among Jehovah's Witnesses worried about how local Watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this Letter of Understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them. Then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the child's best interests."

  Is there anything about that you don't understand?
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  77

  Blood Transfusion: Letter of Understanding

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://ajwrb.org/science/blood-transfusion-letter-of-understanding.

  "every parent among jehovahs witnesses worried about how local watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this letter of understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them.

  then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the childs best interests.".

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  Marvin Shilmer

  What are you saying?

  Fisherman,

  Saying?

  You made an assertion of defender of truth. Of defender of truth you asserted "you advertize that the WT is secretly consenting to blood transfusions".

  The result is defender of truth asked "Where did I say that the Watchtower is consenting to anyone having blood transfusions?"

  I'd say defender of truth is saying, please prove your assertion.
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  59

  Kendrick " Letter of Introduction " from Elders regarding Candace Conti Case

  by flipper in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  as many of us saw in the pbs news hour program and the abc news nightline program the elders from one congregation failed to communicate properly to the elders in another congregation concerning the child molester jonathan kendrick when he moved to a new congregation.

  i have parts of this " introduction letter " from the fremont congregation to the oakley congregation elders so you can read it for yourself and decide how irresponsible these wt appointed elders were.

  dated 1/16/98 it opens : .

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  Marvin Shilmer

  That Kendrick introduction letter is hard to read. It basically set the guy up in business for his next victim!

  I also know that Watchtower has in the past re-appointed men as elders that it knew had a history of sexually molesting a child.

  It is a cult.
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  11

  What Exactly Is The JW View of Physical Discipline, Corporal Punishment?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe that since it is not politically correct to spank your child, the watchtower doesn't push parents anymore in that direction.. years ago, elders would sit a parent down and tell them that they needed to discipline their kids and if needed, give them a spanking, since the bible says, they won't die if you give them a beating.. what is the watchtower's view on this subject now?.

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  Marvin Shilmer

  Historical footage: Watchtower and the Woodshed
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  77

  Blood Transfusion: Letter of Understanding

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://ajwrb.org/science/blood-transfusion-letter-of-understanding.

  "every parent among jehovahs witnesses worried about how local watchtower appointed elders will respond to letting their child have blood transfusion without opposing it should download this letter of understanding and be ready to hand a copy to them.

  then ask those elders to leave them (the parents) and doctors alone to concentrate on the childs best interests.".

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  Marvin Shilmer

  I was reading about the case you mentioned above from the newspaper article (I googled it) and also from your blog. In your blog comments I noticed a commenter referred to an elders only form S-55-E dating from 9/2010.
  Do you happen to know where I could read that letter or what the gist of it is

  You can see the whole S-55-E document HERE.

  I wrote a short blog article about this document titled “No Copies Should Be Made”

  Edited to add: For some reason the link I keep trying to embed to the S-55-E document reverts to plain text after a few moments. Don't know why, but after multiple attempts I've given up. If you check my blog article linked above--which link does remain live for some reason--you'll find where the document is linked for viewing.
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  34

  Pregnant women refuses blood

  by Giordano in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  http://jehovahswitnessreport.com/blog/jw-refusal-of-blood-transfusion-mother-and-baby-die#more-4001.

  a 28-year-old woman and her unborn child have died because of the womans decision not to accept a lifesaving blood transfusion.. doctors at the royal hospital for women and prince of wales hospital in randwick, sydney, australia, have described the harrowing effect on hospital staff of two otherwise avoidable deaths.. the woman, a jehovahs witness, was seven months into her pregnancy when it was discovered she had leukaemia.. amy corderoy, health editor, reporting in the sydney morning herald states,.

  more than 80% of pregnant women suffering from the cancer, called acute promyelocytic leukaemia, will go into remission with proper treatment, and the outlook for their babies is good.. .

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  Marvin Shilmer

  It is estimated that approximately 1000 Jehovah’s Witnesses die annually worldwide and as many as 100,000 may have died by abstaining from blood transfusions since the blood ban was introduced in 1945.

  I don't know the source of Dr. Welsh's statement above, but the figure of 1,000 annual deaths and the figure 100,000 deaths since 1945 is easily the case based on hard data compiled by Drs Beliaev, Marshall, Gordon, Smith and Windsor in their article Clinical benefits and cost-effectiveness of allogeneic red-blood-cell transfusion in severe symptomatic anaemia published in Vox Sanguinis, (2012; 103, 18–24). I've researched and written on this subject and a estimate using that hard data based on very conservative assumptions is that since 1961 at least 50,000 of Jehovah's Witnesses have died due to Watchtower's blood doctrine.